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Seat Fixings - Seat Belt related  Rate Topic 
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 Posted: Thu Apr 12th, 2012 03:17 am
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NITROS44
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Mana: 
Hi Optional:)

I managed to see your video before removal and based on  what i could see the defect would be pass.advise even with that amount of movement.:)

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 Posted: Wed Apr 11th, 2012 04:11 am
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optional
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Had one in myself, so did a video of it, enjoy :)

[Link below, paste into browser]

http://www.metacafe.com/watch/8346843/seat_moving/

Last edited on Thu Apr 12th, 2012 07:56 pm by martins

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 Posted: Mon Apr 9th, 2012 01:27 am
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Aylesbury Jock
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I thought that was the point I was making

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 Posted: Sun Apr 8th, 2012 02:58 am
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NITROS44
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optional wrote: Yeah jock that is what I would think - That's always the way I thought it was to be honest.

But someone pointed out that in the manual it specifically talks about the seat belt only.

Can anyone confirm one way or the other that we define the buckle as part of the seat belt?
BUCKLES/FLEXIBLE STORKS otherwise know as LOCKING MECHANISMS COME UNDER SECTION 5.2 seat belts

A normal seat belt comes in two parts; the belt and the buckle,Once connected the buckle becomes part of the  main seat belt.
So therefore in my opinion connected or not connected its still part of a seat belt,after all you will need both parts for the belt to function correctly:)

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 Posted: Fri Apr 6th, 2012 07:12 pm
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Aylesbury Jock
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NITROS44 wrote:
optional wrote: The buckle does not move and is secure because it is fixed to the outer part of the seat frame. However the seat frame innards are fractured which results in some seat movement (quite a lot actually)

I don't see how this is a failure under 5.2.1 because that relates to seatbelts not buckles?

6.2.1 looks more like an option.

Section 6.2 a deals with security issues with the regards to the seat security to the structure of the vehicles such security of the seat base steel frame and the 4 fixing points of the seat to the floor any other issues would be delt in section 5.2 as this covers fractures and damage to seats that effect seatbelt mounting points such as the buckle:)

I dont think that you have to define that the buckle is part of the seat belt,

  Another way to look at it is the next time you do a test and go to put the results in from another car is to just have a look at the rfr under section 5.2.

I cant remember the exact ref numbers of the rfr but you will see that it says something along the lines of fracture/damage to seat frame effecting the seat belt;meaning that when the belt is fastened to the buckle:)Its not the seat belt that fails its the seat

Very true Nitros, for the issue at hand. I was changing the subject slightly I suppose, but I was thinking if He doesn't realise the buckle is part of the seat belt it would give problems when defining the seat belt prescribed areas when only the buckle is attached to the seat.

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 Posted: Fri Apr 6th, 2012 05:47 am
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NITROS44
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optional wrote: The buckle does not move and is secure because it is fixed to the outer part of the seat frame. However the seat frame innards are fractured which results in some seat movement (quite a lot actually)

I don't see how this is a failure under 5.2.1 because that relates to seatbelts not buckles?

6.2.1 looks more like an option.

Section 6.2 a deals with security issues with the regards to the seat security to the structure of the vehicles such security of the seat base steel frame and the 4 fixing points of the seat to the floor any other issues would be delt in section 5.2 as this covers fractures and damage to seats that effect seatbelt mounting points such as the buckle:)

I dont think that you have to define that the buckle is part of the seat belt,

  Another way to look at it is the next time you do a test and go to put the results in from another car is to just have a look at the rfr under section 5.2.

I cant remember the exact ref numbers of the rfr but you will see that it says something along the lines of fracture/damage to seat frame effecting the seat belt;meaning that when the belt is fastened to the buckle:)Its not the seat belt that fails its the seat

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 Posted: Fri Apr 6th, 2012 04:34 am
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optional
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Yeah jock that is what I would think - That's always the way I thought it was to be honest.

But someone pointed out that in the manual it specifically talks about the seat belt only.

Can anyone confirm one way or the other that we define the buckle as part of the seat belt?

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 Posted: Fri Apr 6th, 2012 04:17 am
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Aylesbury Jock
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Mana: 
I would regard the buckle as part of the belt. A seat belt is not going to restrain you in your seat if the buckle flies off in the impact.

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 Posted: Fri Apr 6th, 2012 04:09 am
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The buckle does not move and is secure because it is fixed to the outer part of the seat frame. However the seat frame innards are fractured which results in some seat movement (quite a lot actually)

I don't see how this is a failure under 5.2.1 because that relates to seatbelts not buckles?

6.2.1 looks more like an option.

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 Posted: Fri Apr 6th, 2012 03:36 am
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Aylesbury Jock
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Mana: 
that would make sense

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 Posted: Thu Apr 5th, 2012 05:31 am
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NITROS44
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kit1958 wrote: Aylesbury Jock wrote:
As I understand the post, the locking stalk is attached to the seat which makes the seat testable as a seat belt mounting


A seatbelt mounted on a broken seat is always a fail
It would depend on which part was broken and weather the extent of the damage EFFECTED the belt

What needs to be taken into consideration here is the issue of weather the buckle is EFFECTED by the split in the frame as it may not necessarily fail,it depends on the location of the split in the frame and weather it does or does not effect the belt.

Did the section of the seat which could be lifted,lift the section the buckle was attached to or did it remain in its same place?
As long as the section containing the attachment is still secure and not damaged and did not lift with the rest of the seat then in my opinion this would be pass/advise for the seat belt condition.

I think now having read Optional post again i think the seat is also pass/advise if the split is above the buckle fixing,:)

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 Posted: Sun Apr 1st, 2012 02:57 am
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kit1958
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Aylesbury Jock wrote:
As I understand the post, the locking stalk is attached to the seat which makes the seat testable as a seat belt mounting


A seatbelt mounted on a broken seat is always a fail

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 Posted: Sun Apr 1st, 2012 02:38 am
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Aylesbury Jock
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Mana: 
As I understand the post, the locking stalk is attached to the seat which makes the seat testable as a seat belt mounting

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 Posted: Sat Mar 31st, 2012 09:01 pm
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optional
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Doesn't seat frame cracked only apply to seats that have the seat belts attached to them i.e bmw soft top?

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 Posted: Sat Mar 31st, 2012 03:03 pm
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rocky69
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Either way its a fail.:D

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 Posted: Sat Mar 31st, 2012 01:21 am
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NITROS44
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optional wrote: Hey,

Would like to hear some thoughts from testers on the following:

Car presented with a seat lifting in one corner - All four anchorage points from the frame to the floor are secure. The seat belt clip is attached to the seat and is secure. The belt itself is fixed to the pillar - The seat back is secure
:)

If the frame is split then i would consider   rfr b section 5.2 under seat belt condition; a seat frame cracked or any damage which significantly weakens the seat frame,:)

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 Posted: Fri Mar 30th, 2012 11:49 pm
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kit1958
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If I'v read this properly the seat belt buckle is fastened to a part of the seat that is not fully secure - fractured. If so fail under fractured seat belt mounting - seat. ;)

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 Posted: Fri Mar 30th, 2012 02:40 pm
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optional
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Hey,

Would like to hear some thoughts from testers on the following:

Car presented with a seat lifting in one corner - All four anchorage points from the frame to the floor are secure. The seat belt clip is attached to the seat and is secure. The belt itself is fixed to the pillar - The seat back is secure

The seat has movement at the back corner where the clip is attached, however the movement is in the frame, to be specific, part of the frame has split.

What would you guys do.

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